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Thread: Counting Cards: A Silly Question or Two

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    Counting Cards: A Silly Question or Two

    I've memorized Basic strategy and now I'm working on counting cards, using High-Low. A silly question or two: (1) Sitting around a table with 4 or 5 players, when do people start the count? I'm doing as soon as the dealer finishes with the first player and then goes on to the next. (I suppose the alternative would be to start once all the cards are dealt) The danger of waiting until the dealer starts with each player is that the cards might be turned over before one finishes the count.

    (2) I've tried whispering "negative" to myself as aid (when I see a high card). Then I decided this took too long and changed to "minus." Now I whisper nothing to myself. Just curious, what do other people do?

    (3) At what point in the true count do people start changing their betting strategy: 3? More?

    Thank you in advance. This forum is a gem.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Bubbles's Avatar
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    It's bad to actually whisper because it looks suspicious. Your lips should never move for any part of counting. I just think in my head. Some people find it helpful to repeatedly think of the number, like "3.. 3... 3.. 3.." until it changes and then repeat with the new number. I don't really do that, but I do mildly if I'm holding a conversation. With practice it becomes easier to keep the count.

    I notice most of us use "minus" to denote negative numbers. I personally use "neg-" because it flows better in my head.
    Last edited by Bubbles; 09-27-2016 at 08:29 AM.

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    First, learn to count cards two at a time. Practice first and get very very fast.

    My approach depends on where I am sitting.

    3rd base: Wait until all the players get their first two cards, then count them with a quick scan of the table. You should have plenty of time because you go last.

    1st base: Same as 3rd base. But if this is too fast for you since the dealer will look to you first for a decision, then start counting when everybody (starting with you) is receiving their second card.

    Anywhere else: Only look at your cards as they are coming out. When everybody gets their cards, then look to your right as the dealer gives turn to the person on first base. This should be safe because it is perfectly normal to look at the person when it is their turn. Then wait until your turn is over and only then count the cards to the person(s) to your left. However, if the count of their cards could affect your playing decision because of an index play variation, then give a quick glance to their cards before you play yours. It usually doesn't affect your decision though so you don't need to do this most of the time.

    2. Sooner or later you may not need to say any words in your head. You will just "see" the number. Until then, I agree that "minus" is better than "negative."

    3. +2

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    I use "mi-", as in mi-1, mi-2, etc.

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    I simply use m:

    So, a negative 3 would be m3. The trick is to use the least amount of syllables.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenix View Post
    "I notice most of us use "minus" to denote negative numbers. I personally use "neg" .
    I use "M" ... (non-verbally) saying "M" to myself has been the best for me.

    I use "Zed" for zero or naught.

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    I don't like dealing with negatives at all in my running count, so for instance with Hi-Opt II (I use for DD games), I will start my running count at 20. This takes a little extra work on doing the TC conversions but I prefer that to the confusion (change of count direction) that comes with negatives. I don't want to make an error in the running count!!

    Ace side count is simply a,b,c, etc.. I tried all the hand and toe stuff for side counts and found nothing easier than just using the letters after the numbers. I also practice seeing the count/visualizing the numbers. The count seems to stay with me better that way..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigdaddy View Post
    I don't like dealing with negatives at all in my running count, so for instance with Hi-Opt II (I use for DD games), I will start my running count at 20. This takes a little extra work on doing the TC conversions but I prefer that to the confusion (change of count direction) that comes with negatives. I don't want to make an error in the running count!!

    Ace side count is simply a,b,c, etc.. I tried all the hand and toe stuff for side counts and found nothing easier than just using the letters after the numbers. I also practice seeing the count/visualizing the numbers. The count seems to stay with me better that way..
    I use toes for the aces. I find it easier simply because I don't have to "say" as much in my mind. It also helps when there is a pause in the game, like doing a fill or something. I can just keep my toe in place and not have to keep a number or letter in my mind. I simply refer to the toe position later when I need it.
    I get the feeling that I am in the minority though. I think most keep track of this in their mind.

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    I'm in training but what I've read is its good to keep it short as possible.
    I use "M" for - counts like the others have said and "Z" for zero

    M3, M2, M1, Z, 1, 2, 3....

  10. #10
    Senior Member Joe Mama's Avatar
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    That's what works for me, M for minus, Z for zero, just numbers for positives. In shoe games I don't start counting until first base gets second card (easy to cancel +'s and -"s.) Then I continue to count hit cards, then dealer cards.

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    If your eyes dart about, or if your eyes are fervently
    staring right at the discard rack you'll not last long.

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    Quote Originally Posted by marriedputter View Post
    I use toes for the aces. I find it easier simply because I don't have to "say" as much in my mind. It also helps when there is a pause in the game, like doing a fill or something. I can just keep my toe in place and not have to keep a number or letter in my mind. I simply refer to the toe position later when I need it.
    I get the feeling that I am in the minority though. I think most keep track of this in their mind.
    Thank you, marriedputter. I don't think I laughed so hard since watching "We're The Millers" (the movie). Toes. I will try that. It's funny that in my naivete, I somehow managed to zero in on everyone's eccentric way of counting cards. Toes, "mi," and I bet it gets a whole lot weirder, with most of us too embarrassed to disclose. (Mind you, I'm not being judgmental in that I'm certain I'm just as weird, actually probably weirder than anyone. Hilarious. I could barely write this out. Thank you everyone. Toes. I must admit, marriedputter, you inspired me to utilize other body parts. I'll stop here before I start getting off topic. Thank you. Thank you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clint View Post
    Thank you, marriedputter. I don't think I laughed so hard since watching "We're The Millers" (the movie). Toes. I will try that. It's funny that in my naivete, I somehow managed to zero in on everyone's eccentric way of counting cards. Toes, "mi," and I bet it gets a whole lot weirder, with most of us too embarrassed to disclose. (Mind you, I'm not being judgmental in that I'm certain I'm just as weird, actually probably weirder than anyone. Hilarious. I could barely write this out. Thank you everyone. Toes. I must admit, marriedputter, you inspired me to utilize other body parts. I'll stop here before I start getting off topic. Thank you. Thank you.
    A great many years ago, I used to own one of those blackjack computers that you wear under your clothes. It was operated in the shoes with your big toes. This is how I thought of using toes for keeping track of aces. I was used to it so it was easy for me. They can't see your subtle toe movement (highly unlikely at least), but they can see foot positions if they want to. This is why I use toes instead of foot positions.
    Last edited by marriedputter; 09-28-2016 at 12:49 PM. Reason: correct spelling

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