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Thread: What kills the progression player?

  1. #27


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    If thwarting martingales had anything to do with it why wouldn't all the tables in the casino have the same ratio of max bet to min bet?
    Because each game has a different edge and variance. Geez

  2. #28
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    • Chip trays have a fixed amount of space. It makes no sense to populate every tray with every size chip.
    • High-limit players often do not like to play with low-limit players and low-limit players often do not like to play with high-limit players. So, they are segregated to a degree.
    • The high-limit tables are watched more carefully.
    • High-limit tables are less likely to be manned by less experienced dealers.
    • Winning-hand payoffs are slower if players are betting many different chip sizes.
    • High-limit tables are kept less crowded to provide more comfort to higher-limit players and to speed the play of larger bettors. Speed is just as important to the casino as it is to the advantage player. Some high-limit tables are often kept in separate areas or even on a separate floor.
    • The limits also prevent ridiculously large bet changes, which could be of value to an advantage player.
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

  3. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Picasso View Post
    Read page 17 (thanks Philippe). It doesn’t adequately explain why the max but wouldn’t be the same for every table.
    It says it wants to keep the big players separate from the lower limit players. That is pretty clear.

  4. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoneWoLF View Post
    Because each game has a different edge and variance. Geez
    My statement was a response to they set table limits to thwart martingalers. Obviously that isn't true because a martingales can start with the lowest limit in the casino and table hope until his bets can't be made at the highest limit table in the casino. The martingaler can even change to a higher end casino with much higher limits when the next bet can't be made at ant table in the casino he started.

  5. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    It says it wants to keep the big players separate from the lower limit players. That is pretty clear.
    I'm talking MAX BET. If you want to keep the high rollers separate, just raise the minimum bet.

  6. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Picasso View Post
    I'm talking MAX BET. If you want to keep the high rollers separate, just raise the minimum bet.
    Both are different but the ratios might not be constant. It all varies by casino.

  7. #33
    Random number herder Norm's Avatar
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    I provided seven of the many reasons. The claim that casinos set table limits worried about progression players is based on nothing.
    "I don't think outside the box; I think of what I can do with the box." - Henri Matisse

  8. #34
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    Your reasons Norm are only opinions, no more than table limits are used by casinos to counter progressions as an 8th reason. No claims either way.

  9. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Picasso View Post
    Your reasons Norm are only opinions, no more than table limits are used by casinos to counter progressions as an 8th reason. No claims either way.
    They send limos to the airport and pay the airfare to get martingalers that are well funded to the casino. Th idea that they fear them in any way is ridiculous and shows you just don't understand the interaction between house edge and bets. They will win your total amount bet times the house edge. Why wouldn't they want you to bet more? It increases their EV.

  10. #36
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    One thing I can add to this discussion and it’s happened to me at least 3 times playing blackjack online: I was winning a significant amount of money (in the thousands) when the casino either raised the minimum bet or decreased the maximum bet significantly …and it worked…I cashed out and took my business elsewhere. In all of these 3 cases the casino changed the limits on me to invite me out. Of course, they are not worried about counters online.

  11. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Picasso View Post
    One thing I can add to this discussion and it’s happened to me at least 3 times playing blackjack online: I was winning a significant amount of money (in the thousands) when the casino either raised the minimum bet or decreased the maximum bet significantly …and it worked…I cashed out and took my business elsewhere. In all of these 3 cases the casino changed the limits on me to invite me out. Of course, they are not worried about counters online.
    They were foolish. Now when the streak that takes all your profits and the some happens some other casino will be getting your BR. All martingale progression does is change the ride to the same long run as any player that doesn't play with an advantage. The house edge times the total amount you ever bet. All that chasing with bigger bets just increases your total mount ever bet and your lose when things converge on expectation in the long run.

  12. #38
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    I wasn't playing a Martingale, but the facts remain; they used table limits to their advantage.

  13. #39
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    All progressions that don't change their bet to sync with advantage situations lose the house edge times the total amount ever bet in the long run.

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