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Thread: advice from the pros

  1. #1


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    advice from the pros

    Hello i'm a newbie looking to take my game to the next level and would like some advice from some more experienced players. I have been practicing on CV for about 2 years 4-5 hrs a day now (I have a luxury job) while playing in local casinos and usually balancing out with my money (not winning or loosing) on CV I am playing 98-100% correct play keeping the count on hi-lo and using basic deviations keeping the simulated heat low and 100% on betting strategy. I feel i'm not fully using the program to the fullest to maximize my profit in the casino, in your opinion what are some other good tools (on CV or not) to use and how would they be used to the fullest?

    My plan is to go play a $5 6:5, H17, DS table with a $600 trip BR making $30 my max bet giving me 20 max bets. Playing nothing more than TC-2 sitting out until the count becomes favorable and TC+2=$10 +3=$20 +4=$30 being max bet. I understand this might be a little aggressive but BJ is not my job and I am fully prepared to work some more and save another BR while continuing to practice. Any advice or tips on how I can maximize my trip would be helpful.

    Also I have been looking at shuffle tracing but I'm not understanding it because my understanding is the object is to clump the high cards together which would cause the count to go extremely negative and as a counter I am looking for a positive count. Why would this be beneficial to a counter and is it really worth the time learning?

    Thanks for any feedback

  2. #2


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    Be prepared to lose your bankroll. The house edge, regardless of what it is since I'm not sure if the total rule set, is further enhanced by more than a full point with 6:5 payout. This means that there is no way you will beat the game long term, especially with that low spread.

    If anything, play a higher min without 6:5, flat bet or low spread to retain your limited bankroll as long as possible, and pay the tuition cost to season yourself a bit. Sounds like you could use some simulation software.

  3. #3


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    Quote Originally Posted by sdanny29 View Post
    Hello i'm a newbie looking to take my game to the next level and would like some advice from some more experienced players. I have been practicing on CV for about 2 years 4-5 hrs a day now (I have a luxury job) while playing in local casinos and usually balancing out with my money (not winning or loosing) on CV I am playing 98-100% correct play keeping the count on hi-lo and using basic deviations keeping the simulated heat low and 100% on betting strategy. I feel i'm not fully using the program to the fullest to maximize my profit in the casino, in your opinion what are some other good tools (on CV or not) to use and how would they be used to the fullest?

    My plan is to go play a $5 6:5, H17, DS table with a $600 trip BR making $30 my max bet giving me 20 max bets. Playing nothing more than TC-2 sitting out until the count becomes favorable and TC+2=$10 +3=$20 +4=$30 being max bet. I understand this might be a little aggressive but BJ is not my job and I am fully prepared to work some more and save another BR while continuing to practice. Any advice or tips on how I can maximize my trip would be helpful.

    Also I have been looking at shuffle tracing but I'm not understanding it because my understanding is the object is to clump the high cards together which would cause the count to go extremely negative and as a counter I am looking for a positive count. Why would this be beneficial to a counter and is it really worth the time learning?

    Thanks for any feedback
    theminute you mention playing a 6:5 game, you probably lost all the more experienced players here. They don't sit at 6:5 tables.

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    The only reason I said 6:5 table is because that is the only $5 table in my area everything else is $10 or more. I wasn't sure about playing a $10 table with such a limited bankroll

  5. #5


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    I have been using casino Verite for about 2 years now is there something else I could use?

  6. #6


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    Quote Originally Posted by sdanny29 View Post
    I have been using casino Verite for about 2 years now is there something else I could use?
    That's the one to use - make sure it is marked for 6:5

  7. #7


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    The risk of losing it all is high for both. The 6:5 makes it inevitable, the $10 table is better. With such a small BR, you should probably back count and only enter the game at TC+2, play $25 at TC3, $50 at TC 4 and leave if the count drops below TC2.

    Build your BR and keep learning.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Jabberwocky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sdanny29 View Post
    I have been using casino Verite for about 2 years now is there something else I could use?
    $10k!

  9. #9


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    Quote Originally Posted by Jabberwocky View Post
    $10k!
    Though funny, believe it or not, I built a significant bankroll with $600 of very replenishable seed money. I topped it up by maybe a couple of hundred in the first few months, but really never looked back. I would not categorize my cumulative win as chump change. It can be done - granted, conditions were pretty good then for low rollers.

    The unspoken one, KJ, actually built his initial low roller bankroll and paid living expenses from red chip play. Sacrifices made must have been significant, but somehow or another, he managed to survive, and apparently prosper.

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    When I tried my latest venture I started with risking $800 of my BR. I grew that to 6 figures and moved the rest of my initial BR to personal funds. However I was not a green newbie. I was just trying some new techniques that had never been tried before and didn't want to go broke doing it. Fortunately losses were bookended by big wins so I didn't get wiped out and have to decide to reseed the endeavor or give it up. When my BR hit almost $50K I upped my spread and immediately hit a wicked losing run. I lost over 1/3rd of my BR and drawdown to my initial bet spread just in time for the winning run to hit. It took a lot longer to make it back at the smaller bet ramp but I did and when I made that much back again I increased my spread a second time and did well. The losing run would have easily wiped out a smaller BR even at a smaller spread.
    Quote Originally Posted by sdanny29 View Post
    Hello i'm a newbie looking to take my game to the next level and would like some advice from some more experienced players.
    My advice is start with a simple system like Hilo or KO. Get that system down cold before you start playing in the casino. You can practice on your computer at no monetary risk, no travel costs and without exposing yourself as a counter when you are easiest to spot. Get a copy of Don Schlesinger's book, Blackjack Attack edition 3. There are many many non counting things having to do with BJ that are necessary for success. Many are found in Don's book. Read it at regular interval's in your development. Each chapter will make you more money in the casino. Read and reread them. it will probably be your most referenced book and become indispensable. Good luck. We are here when you need us. Once you get lots of experience at proficiently using the beginner counts you can decide if you are happy with your results or want into what more complicated approaches have to offer. It is very likely your results have little to do with your count at that point and have more to do with needing to learn more of the non counting stuff but at that point you should be ready to address the issue of changing counts if you want to.

  11. #11


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    Quote Originally Posted by sdanny29 View Post
    The only reason I said 6:5 table is because that is the only $5 table in my area everything else is $10 or more. I wasn't sure about playing a $10 table with such a limited bankroll
    6:5 blackjack cannot be beaten, unless you plan on using a 100:1 spread or something LOL. If you see a 6:5 BJ table, run away!


    I'm assuming the other $10 3:2 games are shoe games, right? I hate to break it to you, but you have almost no chance of beating that game either with a 6:1 spread (unless you're Wonging in/out aggressively).


    It seems as if you're a recreational player who is doing this as a hobby. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that. This game can be fun. If I were you, I would only play at the $10 tables (3:2 game) and use at least a spread of 10:1. You have a high chance of busting out, so I wouldn't go in with high hopes. But if you are seriously considering in making this a profitable venture, you will most likely need a larger starting BR. But I do know a couple full time pros that started out with a pretty small bankroll (KJ is one of them and the other guy is a friend of mine). So it's doable.

    Good luck
    Last edited by Ryemo; 07-18-2016 at 04:08 PM.

  12. #12


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryemo View Post
    6:5 blackjack cannot be beaten, unless you plan on using a 100:1 spread or something LOL. If you see a 6:5 BJ table, run away!

    I'm assuming this is a shoe game? I hate to break it to you, but you have almost no chance of beating that game with a 6:1 spread (unless you're Wonging in/out aggressively).

    Good luck
    Even aggressive wonging won't do it.

  13. #13


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    Quote Originally Posted by Freightman View Post
    Even aggressive wonging won't do it.
    I wasn't implying that he could beat the 6:5 shoe game with aggressive Wonging. I meant if he was playing a regular 3:2 shoe. If he only played positive counts in the 3:2 game, it could be beaten.

    Sorry if I wasn't clear on that.

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