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Thread: Ohio Gamimg Law - Theory and Practice

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    Ohio Gamimg Law - Theory and Practice

    Just interested if anyone on this forum has been ejected (86'd) or knows of anyone who was ejected from an Ohio casino only because he was suspected of card counting. Looking at the Ohio Gaming Commission law, it appears that the circumstances that could justify an ejection are limited and they definitely do not include card counting. Note the relevant sections below:
    (I) "Cheat" means to alter the result of a casino game, the element of chance, the operation of a machine used in a casino game, or the method of selection of criteria that determines (a) the result of the casino game, (b) the amount or frequency of payment in a casino game, (c) the value of a wagering instrument, or (d) the value of a wagering credit. "Cheat" does not include an individual who, without the assistance of another individual or without the use of a physical aid or device of any kind, uses the individual's own ability to keep track of the value of cards played and uses predictions formed as a result of the tracking information in the individual's playing and betting strategy.
    (G) The commission may eject or exclude or authorize the ejection or exclusion of and a gaming agent may eject a person from a casino facility for any of the following reasons:(1) The person's name is on the list of persons voluntarily excluding themselves from all casinos in a program established according to rules adopted by the commission;
    (2) The person violates or conspires to violate this chapter or a rule adopted thereunder; or
    (3) The commission determines that the person's conduct or reputation is such that the person's presence within a casino facility may call into question the honesty and integrity of the casino gaming operations or interfere with the orderly conduct of the casino gaming operations.
    (H) A person, other than a person participating in a voluntary exclusion program, may petition the commission for a public hearing on the person's ejection or exclusion under this chapter.
    (I) A casino operator or management company shall have the same authority to eject or exclude a person from the management company's casino facilities as authorized in division (G) of this section. The licensee shall immediately notify the commission of an ejection or exclusion.

    It would seem from the above law, that they would have a difficult time ejecting a well-behaved card counter that was not operating with a teammate (note the prohibition on using the "assistance of another individual"). So maybe a back-off, but ejection??

    Anybody have any experience with back-offs or ejections in one of the 4 Ohio casinos?

  2. #2
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    I (and a friend) were trespassed from an Ohio casino.

    The most striking thing about the experience was the State Gaming Agent whose
    interest was solely in threatening me with arrest and demanding my identification.
    I managed to take a photo of him.

    Gaming Agents are tasked with protecting the public from the casino management.

    Role of Gaming Agents
    Gaming agents are certified peace officers in the State of Ohio and have arrest authority on the casino floor. The agents are headquartered at their respective casinos and staff a 24-7 operation. Their responsibilities include enforcement of R.C. 3772.99,
    a newly enacted set of criminal gaming statutes created to ensure a fair gaming environment for casino patrons.


    At the Ohio Casino Control Commission's web site, I once found an extensive compendium of photos, etc. of Ohio's barred players, mostly petty criminals.

    It has been redacted; replaced by a list of cheating EMPLOYEES:

    http://casinocontrol.ohio.gov/Portals/0/pdf/Involuntary%20Exclusion/2016%20Involuntary%20Exclusion%20List.pdf


    Last edited by ZenMaster_Flash; 06-14-2016 at 04:05 PM.

  3. #3


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    Quote Originally Posted by ZenMaster_Flash View Post


    I (and a friend) were trespassed from an Ohio casino.

    The most striking thing about the experience was the State Gaming Agent whose
    interest was solely in threatening me with arrest and demanding my identification.
    I managed to take a photo of him.
    Looks like the law provides for a right of appeal to the Gaming Commission. Did you consider an appeal on the grounds that you did not violate any of the stated rules that constitute grounds for ejection?

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    It's talking about cheating. I didn't see anything about the CASINO being allowed to or not allowed to 86 (unless the casino has gaming agents on staff?).
    "Everyone wants to be rich, but nobody wants to work for it." -Ryan Howard [The Office]

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    Quote Originally Posted by RollingStoned View Post
    It's talking about cheating. I didn't see anything about the CASINO being allowed to or not allowed to 86 (unless the casino has gaming agents on staff?).
    (I) A casino operator or management company shall have the same authority to eject or exclude a person from the management company's casino facilities as authorized in division (G) of this section. The licensee shall immediately notify the commission of an ejection or exclusion.

    I take this to mean that the Casino management has the same authority as the Commission to eject a person but again it would only be for the limited causes stated in Sections G1 - 3.

  6. #6


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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigdaddy View Post
    (I) A casino operator or management company shall have the same authority to eject or exclude a person from the management company's casino facilities as authorized in division (G) of this section. The licensee shall immediately notify the commission of an ejection or exclusion.

    I take this to mean that the Casino management has the same authority as the Commission to eject a person but again it would only be for the limited causes stated in Sections G1 - 3.
    Yes, they cannot be ejected for anything not listed, including murder.

    Instead of angrily clicking hate buttons, does someone want to explain why Missouri can't bar counters? I'm honestly asking, I'd like an explanation. Seemed like an appropriate thread to ask.

  7. #7


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    Of course they can kick you out. Nothing in the rules says they can kick you out for murdering people. Presumably, that conduct would not be tolerated.

    For that matter, I do not understand why APs have unilaterally decided that Missouri can't bar counters. The only law I'm aware says that counting isn't cheating. Well, we already know that; a gaming regulation stating as much tells us nothing, except maybe that it would be easier to sue over a wrongful detention. What's relevant is whether the casino can refuse service for any reason (excluding race, gender, etc.). In most states, the answer is yes. Only in New Jersey did a court decide the answer is no. I know of no court case in Missouri.

  8. #8
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    Only a doofus would appeal.

    That is a no-win situation.

    If I win they deal me a hand and shuffle.

    Countermeasures !


  9. #9


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    Boz, I love you. I'm sorry I thought you were a ruthless shit, when you were actually a ruthless shit.

  10. #10


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    Quote Originally Posted by Villiam View Post
    Boz, I love you. I'm sorry I thought you were a ruthless shit, when you were actually a ruthless shit.
    Well, it's all over the Internet that Missouri can't ban counters. I'm assuming someone here has been flat bet in Missouri, and can explain why they weren't backed off, since APs have taken it as true. Sorry, I don't assume everything I read on the Internet is true without question.

    As far as the Ohio law, we have a law that says absolutely nothing remotely related to not being able to bar counters. Flash clearly says he was trespassed for counting. And the OP still wants to know if the Ohio casinos are powerless to stop APs. So just tell him yes, because that's the only thing he cares to hear.

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