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Thread: Getting Backed Off

  1. #1


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    Getting Backed Off

    I don't post here that much but I have a question. I have been backed off from several stores here on the east coast. I have since returned with only a few of them backing me off again. They all say I can flat bet, but not banned permanently. My question is if I don't show them ID, what measures can they take if I keep going back? I know I can be trespassed, but if they don't know who I am, how can they give me something in writing to trespass me?

  2. #2


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    Stop.

    Leave them alone for a few months. If you do go back, go on another shift.

    Just coming back to a place where you are flat-bet makes us all look bad, and it makes you memorable and likely to get flyered.
    The Cash Cow.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by winnawinna View Post
    "They all say I can flat bet, but not banned permanently. My question is if I don't show them ID, what measures can they take if I keep going back? I know I can be trespassed, but if they don't know who I am, how can they give me something in writing to trespass me?"
    I have been trespassed by certified mail (in PA).

    Playing anonymously, they have given you an "assigned name", and they have hi-def photos of you as well.

    If they really want to trespass you, they have to summon the local/state/Indian police and shake the I.D.

    out of your pockets. If simple intimidation and lies fail, they can invent "probable cause" for some non-existent

    cheating or misdemeanor behavior and you MUST show ID to the police - and they ALWAYS give you up to the

    Casino Suits. Always.


  4. #4


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    Quote Originally Posted by winnawinna View Post
    My question is if I don't show them ID, what measures can they take if I keep going back? I know I can be trespassed, but if they don't know who I am, how can they give me something in writing to trespass me?
    If you've never played rated in any east coast casino (or anywhere in the country really), I think it would be hard for them to identify you. Although, there are other tactics like running your license plate #, tracking your name from a credit card transaction you made while in that store maybe for food or a ATM withdrawal, playing slots with a players card, or if they want it bad enough they can send a photo of you to the entire east coast to see if any surveillance depts. recognize your photo so they can attach a name to it, or the easiest way is grabbing your info from the ID scanner at the door (applies to all PA casinos).

    Being that you can 'only flat bet', if you get creative you can hurt them; Example - if you start only wonging into +TCs then you will more than likely be playing for about 1.5x your EV per round, compared to all play especially on the east coast where most stores offer LS and s17.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangechip2 View Post
    or the easiest way is grabbing your info from the ID scanner at the door (applies to all PA casinos).
    I must be getting old. They never scan my ID in Pa.

  6. #6


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    I must be getting old. They never scan my ID in Pa.
    then you obviously look over 30.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangechip2 View Post
    then you obviously look over 30.
    I looked over 30 before I was 18. LoL

  8. #8


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    If they have pics/video and a report of you being read a trespass warning and then you come back, they could have you arrested for trespassing depending on the jurisdiction.

  9. #9


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    Winna, Showing them ID has nothing to do with the manor in which they back you off. A casino does not have to give you notice in writing in order to trespass you. In most cases, the owner or a representative of the owner can give you verbal notice and this is sufficient. They dont need your name if they have you arrested for trespass based upon your photo alone and they know you are the same person previously evicted. For example, PA casinos ahve a state police officer on duty at every property 24/7 so it wont take long for him to come meet with you and investigate to find your name and place it on a criminal complaint for trespass.

    As im sure you are aware, New Jersey casinos cannot exclude you from the casino on the basis of counting cards, so they will ALWAYS resort to flat betting or similar.

    As for other east coast states, the laws of the land have not made clear if its appropriate to exclude card counters, though they generally take the position to attempt to exclude you through trespass, and I would assume they might prosecute if you returned.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by ACFERRET View Post
    "New Jersey casinos cannot exclude you from the casino on the basis of counting cards, so they will ALWAYS resort to flat betting or similar."
    The last time that I ran into real high heat in AC -- the Taj Mahal last year.
    It was one of the nastiest casino security incidents that I have ever had.
    It was NOT like what I had experienced over the prior years.
    A squadron of goons and a LOT of suits demanded that the game be stopped;
    and tried to force me (and a partner) to give them I.D. and answer questions,
    as they tried in vain to "backroom" us. They spouted all the usual lies, but they
    had no idea who they were dealing with, as so to speak.

  11. #11
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    A while back I was being trespassed, based solely upon my photo,
    at a big East Coast casino that was a Native American enterprise.

    I had NO identification on me whatsoever.

    They called in the State Police, who of course acted as their minion,
    threatened to have me put behind bars, etc. and detained me for
    almost 2 hrs.

  12. #12


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    Quote Originally Posted by ZenMaster_Flash View Post

    A while back I was being trespassed, based solely upon my photo,
    at a big East Coast casino that was a Native American enterprise.

    I had NO identification on me whatsoever.

    They called in the State Police, who of course acted as their minion,
    threatened to have me put behind bars, etc. and detained me for
    almost 2 hrs.
    When the police show up at a time like this, you gotta drop the hammer and put them in thier place, tell the police to file complaints againts the actors for assaulting you during thier unlawfull detention, and prosecute them. If enough people man up and start doing this, this kind of crap will slow down.

    I am so sick of this crap, Now with the knowledge I have, If a caisno ever again denies me redemption of chips, I am going to rail the cage employee criminally, and any employee who assists will get railed for criminal conspiracy.

  13. #13


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    Yep, ACFERRET is right. You need to know, with great precision, the trespass and identification laws wherever you play.

    And if confronted by police, it's best to record the interaction (check the laws on recording on a casino floor). Having your rights violated means nothing if you can't PROVE they are violated.

    If they violate your rights, you can go into federal court (under Section 1983). And, unlike a kangaroo court in front of Gaming officials, federal judges don't suffer civil rights violations so lightly. They handle civil rights claims with some frequency, and they are not elected and afraid of handing down a judgment against state officials.
    The Cash Cow.

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