Split - BJ

[Vezalke]

Hello,
Does anyone know what's the house disadvantage if they pay out blackjack even on split hands? But, the blackjack is paid 6:5.

[Shadowless]

Less than 0.19% since that would be the player advantage if it paid 3:2, according to Wizard's rule variations page.

Couldn't find player advantage for split aces paying 6:5 if it's ace and ten.

[Vezalke]

Aha, thank you. Any idea how to calculate it for BJ paying 6:5?

[ZenMaster_Flash]

If you know the value for the extra 0.5 unit premium on a blackjack,
then that value is reduced proportionally in accord with the 6:5 rule.
You gain only 40% of the value.

[Vezalke]

Thank you!

[moo321]

Yeah, the value of the rule is very dynamic, much like surrender. As penetration increases, so does the value of an improved payoff on 21, and an automatic winner on split 21.

[Romes]

If it's all splits past just split aces then I would expect it to be at least somewhat close to the 0.19% from the Wiz's rules variation.

[Smartblackjack]

If you split a pair of aces and get 2 tens on them you have 2 21's not two blackjacks you will be paid what you bet assuming dealer does not make 21. 6/5 blackjack is the worst player rule and tripples the house advantage.

[DSchles]

"If you know the value for the extra 0.5 unit premium on a blackjack,
then that value is reduced proportionally in accord with the 6:5 rule.
You gain only 40% of the value."

Sorry, math is wrong. 3:2 is 150%; 6:5 is 120%. The reduction is 30% on a base of 150%, or 1/5, which is 20%. So the gain is 80% of the original value. If that original value was 0.19%, then the new value would be 80% of 0.19%, or 0.152%.

Don

[All Clear]

"If you know the value for the extra 0.5 unit premium on a blackjack,
then that value is reduced proportionally in accord with the 6:5 rule.
You gain only 40% of the value."

Sorry, math is wrong. 3:2 is 150%; 6:5 is 120%. The reduction is 30% on a base of 150%, or 1/5, which is 20%. So the gain is 80% of the original value. If that original value was 0.19%, then the new value would be 80% of 0.19%, or 0.152%.

Don

I rarely respond on these threads, but the opportunity to correct both Don and Flash doesn't come about too often....

What Flash misses, is that the 0.19% advantage the Wizard quotes, is not only due to the extra 50% payout on a blackjack, but also due to the fact that this hand is an automatic winner (and doesn't push against a dealer drawn 21). Therefore, the gain will be higher than just 40% of 0.19%

What Don misses, is that a hand split to a 21 is almost always a winner, and changing the "almost" in that sentence to "definitely", COMBINED with the 3:2 payout, is what leads to the 0.19% advantage (number as per Wizard of Odds, mentioned earlier in this thread). In order to determine the factor to adjust the 0.19% if we have a 6:5 payout, we need to know how much of the 0.19% is due to each of the two factors just mentioned. Don's reduction of 20% (30% on a base of 150%) would only make sense if (note: this rule obviously doesn't exist anywhere) when we normally split aces and get a ten, we automatically PUSH the hand (no matter what the dealer ends up with). If (in this bizarro world) we would normally push every single two card 21 after we split, and there is a new rule in one casino in this bizarro world where instead we are paid 3:2 and automatically win (and this rule would give us 0.19% more), then to figure out the adjustment for 6:5, we can do as Don says, and reduce the 0.19% by 20%, to 0.152%, since we are getting 3:2 (150%) or 6:5 (120%), instead of the default "nothing" (or a push, 0%).

(My apologies- this paragraph is now slightly off the topic)
Correcting both Don and Flash- I feel smart now. This after another five hours of my continued attempts earlier today to keep two running counts, one of them a level three count, in my head at the same time.... which is making me feel far less smart. I bet Don and Flash can keep multiple running counts in their heads at once- feel free to add any hints in my "Keeping track of side counts in shoe games" thread. :-)