Identity theft

[Norm]

The machines guaranteed that you would get your money back if you played ten hands without a win. Good gimmick. They had counters that showed consecutive losses. If the counter hit ten, you got back your ten coins. Of course, you could lose eight coins and then get a winner of one coin, and the counter would reset. So, they still had a house advantage. But, players that didn’t understand the machines would walk away with a counter at nine. At that point, you can’t lose on the next hand. And with lower counters than nine, you still had odds heavily in your favor.

Problem is, some really grimmy looking locals were often hanging around the machines and the casinos had to spend time chasing them off as it was creepy. Here's a situation where I think it makes perfect sense for a casino to ban an AP. These guys didn't actually change the overall edge. But, it started looking like the lobby of a flophouse.

[muffdiver]

Thanks for the explanation. My guess is, that you don't encourage people to make "slot AP" a livelihood.

[Norm]

No, I don't encourage APs to forget to bathe and wash their clothing.

[moo321]

Thanks for the explanation. My guess is, that you don't encourage people to make "slot AP" a livelihood.

No, it's not a full-time gig. It's an opportunity that you may spot every once in awhile while scouting for other things.

[Exoter175]

No, it's not a full-time gig. It's an opportunity that you may spot every once in awhile while scouting for other things.

I disagree entirely, and the basis for that is entirely valued on the ratio of AP slots to Ploppys playing them, divided by the number of "hustlers" or "Slot AP's".

Here's the thing about Slot AP'ing. You have to know every square inch of the building, and you have to COVER It, constantly on the move. You have to know where every single machine is, who your competition is, what numbers they "come up with" on a given play, which "plays" they play, and their schedule. It is incredibly complex and "difficult" but like counting, with repetition and practice comes ease.

The +EV charts on some of these plays are so absolutely ridiculous they make ANY count in blackjack look like chump change by comparison. It is absolutely, hands down the best AP play in the building at any one time, the problem is the number of "plays" you'll acquire.

As an example, do you know what the +EV is on a 10 play dime DDBP Ultimate X machine with 3x mults on every hand? That's a pretty "common" find, I find one at LEAST every day. Its astronomical, is what it is. Some of those Ultimate X games are known to reach +EV plays greater than a 724% advantage for the play.

Lets use another example for a moment here. Saturday I went into my local place during bad weather, half expecting every play to be taken, but came to find out that no other Slot AP's had been in the building. I played approximately 23 hands of Ultimate X Poker, all with a max pay-table "sub max" bet receiving a multiplier. By the time I was done on those 12 machines, approximately 7 minutes of cycling and playing, and the ticket reader giving me grief, I had gained $97.25

Later that same day, I waited on another "Slot AP play" called "Rock around the clock". I picked this machine up at the equivalent of 11:15 and was just 80 cents into the game before its guaranteed "accumulator" bonus was given out, of which has attached progressive shots. I don't know the +EV on that specific play as it would constantly be manipulated by the progressives associated with it, however, getting on it at 11:15 is about as "guaranteed" as you're going to get for a money maker in the casino, and it just so happened to take me two spins to get there. During the bonus, I had cleared out ~$7.50 from the "credit" game and hit the progressive "switch" and cleared out the ~$124.50 progressive.

I spent about a grand total of 30-40 minutes that day on "Slot AP" stuff and ended up "leaving" up $28X.XX

Most guys that I know that "Slot AP" as a full time gig make about 85-115 a day average, with Sun-Wed being closer to 45-60 per day, and days like Saturday being about as close to 200 a day as you can get.

Again, though, it entirely depends on your surroundings. It would be absolutely impossible to "full time" Slot AP on these specific machines in downtown vegas as they are over crowded and the "Silver Miners" or "Seagulls" have pretty much killed every play out there. If you're like me, however, and you live far away from Vegas and in a state that also has "pay by progressives", then you'd probably make a pretty comfy living "full time" as a slot AP in a casino that gets moderate action with only a "few" "hustlers".

[moo321]

1. I wasn't including Ultimate X.

2. I don't think $85-115 a day is a full time gig. Other's views may differ.

[Exoter175]

1. I wasn't including Ultimate X.

2. I don't think $85-115 a day is a full time gig. Other's views may differ.

It largely depends on your location. I know guys that have the place all to themselves with 15-20+ machines who work 12+ hour shifts and bring home about $220 daily average 7 days a week which is like, a gold mine considering the downtime those guys will sit through for a few days a week when a casino might be dead. Even at $100 a day, that's pretty close to an "entry level" degree gig in most states in the US. Of course, you'll have to put in about 20-30 more hours per week, but its really not all that bad. Zero stress, free food and drinks, a pretty steady income, and a shot at getting an extremely rare "bonus" that'll set you wayyyyyyy ahead of the curve if you land a Royal, much less one with a multiplier!

Aside from VUX though, yeah I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock in being able to "Make a solid living" on something like WMS progressives or Quick Strike progessives. Those can be some extremely large swings that could take days to recover on and would require a very large "up front" bankroll to get into. Meanwhile VUX is technical doable with a 40 dollar starting budget at the "right" place.

[metronome]

Not sure if myopic is the right word but those that endeavor to destroy a website are also ruining something enjoyed by their colleagues, peers and friends.
I suppose they are too narcissistic to give that a whiff of consideration