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Thread: Double Deck Blackjack

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    Double Deck Blackjack

    I ran simulation on 2 deck DAS, RSA 50% penetration 1-8 bet spread. According to the rules of eleven double deck blackjack is playable heads up but when I simulated the game with the most sophisticate count system like Hi-opt II full indices with Aces side count along with the Zen count I cannot get a SCORE of 50 or more for the game with 1 deck cut off. With Zen count full indices it is hard to get a SCORE of 50 with 60% penetration 1-6 spread.

    There don't seem to be significant amount of gain using 1-12 spread in the game and I don't want to attract too much attention.

    Is it possible to get SCORE of 50 or higher? Is the game even playable with less than 62% penetration in the long run?
    Last edited by seriousplayer; 07-15-2014 at 12:53 PM.

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    Have you tried adding another side count or 2?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    Have you tried adding another side count or 2?
    No I have not added another side count. If I choose to side count I can only keep one side count in my head. I won't be able to keep four different side count in my head that is just too much.
    Last edited by seriousplayer; 07-13-2014 at 05:18 PM.

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    Its the pen 50% blows not even worth playing one on one

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    Quote Originally Posted by SURFER View Post
    Its the pen 50% blows not even worth playing one on one
    I agree, too much chance

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    Quote Originally Posted by SURFER View Post
    Its the pen 50% blows not even worth playing one on one
    Exactly, and I believe I said that in the other thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by AnzaExo View Post
    I agree, too much chance
    Its not so much chance as lack of information.

    The problem with most DD games with sub-par penetration is that A: You won't be able to backcount/wongin as most places keep their DD games as NMSE unless you're in smaller market areas. B: If the RC goes negative, quickly, you won't have much of a chance to redeem yourself on the count before its time to shuffle. C: Most places will either give you some pretty intense heat for your bet spread, or the game itself has some pretty sub-par rules compared to its brothers on the 6D tables.

    Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love SD/DD games when the rules are manageable, denomination is low enough, and the penetration is at least consistently average, I just don't find myself on them often because their penetration hovers around 50-55%, NMSE (for me), and unfavorable rules.

    I keep asking the PB's for a $10 DD game here like I saw in vegas, they won't bite on it.

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    Senior Member bigplayer's Avatar
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    h17 das double deck with 1 deck cutoff is a rotten game. Spreading 1-8 like a robot you cannot get much more than a 0.8% advantage. I would guess a SCORE of $50 (which equals an N0 of 20,000) would be out of the question. You might try redoing it where you sit out all hands with a TC of -6 or worse and see what happens. Problem with that game is you need to play it like an h17 ds shoe game with 1 deck cutoff. Spread 16-1 and sit out the worst 15% or so of negative counts and that game actually becomes decent (esp heads up where the cut card effect is less powerful). Whether a casino would let you use this approach is another question which is why most players simply don't try.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Exoter175 View Post
    Exactly, and I believe I said that in the other thread.



    Its not so much chance as lack of information.

    The problem with most DD games with sub-par penetration is that A: You won't be able to backcount/wongin as most places keep their DD games as NMSE unless you're in smaller market areas. B: If the RC goes negative, quickly, you won't have much of a chance to redeem yourself on the count before its time to shuffle. C: Most places will either give you some pretty intense heat for your bet spread, or the game itself has some pretty sub-par rules compared to its brothers on the 6D tables.

    Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love SD/DD games when the rules are manageable, denomination is low enough, and the penetration is at least consistently average, I just don't find myself on them often because their penetration hovers around 50-55%, NMSE (for me), and unfavorable rules.

    I keep asking the PB's for a $10 DD game here like I saw in vegas, they won't bite on it.
    I see, I'd imagine a DD game with only 50% pen would only last 3-4 rounds with a full table.. True there's not enough time to let a negative count to revert to positive in such little use, resulting in a lot of expensive dry bets.

    Also I've never seen a legitimate $10DD game - I don't think they have much incentive to offer one when the house typically offers plenty of $10 6D and $25DD tables - they seem to be busy enough as is

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    Quote Originally Posted by AnzaExo View Post
    I see, I'd imagine a DD game with only 50% pen would only last 3-4 rounds with a full table.
    The game is unplayable if you don't get heads up or close to it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AnzaExo View Post
    I see, I'd imagine a DD game with only 50% pen would only last 3-4 rounds with a full table.. True there's not enough time to let a negative count to revert to positive in such little use, resulting in a lot of expensive dry bets.

    Also I've never seen a legitimate $10DD game - I don't think they have much incentive to offer one when the house typically offers plenty of $10 6D and $25DD tables - they seem to be busy enough as is
    Go to downtown Vegas, $10 DD tables everywhere, especially during the week.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    The game is unplayable if you don't get heads up or close to it.
    Personally, that game is unplayable even heads up from the sound of it. Not because I couldn't get an advantage and act on it, but because I'd probably have to play too close to the sun and I don't want that kind of heat on me.

    Seems to be lately, you can get away with just about anything on 6D, but DD is a different ball game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Exoter175 View Post
    Go to downtown Vegas, $10 DD tables everywhere, especially during the week.



    Personally, that game is unplayable even heads up from the sound of it. Not because I couldn't get an advantage and act on it, but because I'd probably have to play too close to the sun and I don't want that kind of heat on me.

    Seems to be lately, you can get away with just about anything on 6D, but DD is a different ball game.
    heh, im really showing my inexperience - ive only been to vegas a couple times

    Could you recommend me a location or two?
    Last edited by AnzaExo; 07-14-2014 at 11:47 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AnzaExo View Post
    heh, im really showing my inexperience - ive only been to vegas a couple times

    Could you recommend me a location or two?
    Most of downtown is center cut h17 - not worth playing, maybe one exception. Better opportunities exist off strip. Get a copy of CBJN before your next trip and you will save time and gas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zach Black View Post
    Most of downtown is center cut h17 - not worth playing, maybe one exception. Better opportunities exist off strip. Get a copy of CBJN before your next trip and you will save time and gas.
    Thanks, I'll look into it.

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