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Thread: My advice for making it as an AP

  1. #1


    14 out of 16 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No

    My advice for making it as an AP

    OK, so I’m writing this post because I feel like I have some decent advice to newcomers to this world or casual players looking to take things to the next level. Really this is about what I think it takes to be successful in the AP world. I by no means consider myself the finished article and I still have a lot to learn and achieve, but I am a player who has successfully made the transition from novice to part-time and then from part-time to full-time. You may not agree with the advice I have, fair enough, but hopefully some of you will find it useful:

    1. Network effectively. This is the single biggest determinant of your success as an AP. If it wasn’t the players I’ve met along the way, I would have made a tenth of the money and had a tenth of the fun. Here are my top two tips for networking effectively:

    • Think about what you can do for other people, not what they can do for you. Leverage whatever info and skills you have to help other people. This will help build strong relationships with other players and you will reap the rewards. And don’t worry about everything being ‘fair’ – he told me about a game that is worth $2 when I told him about a game that is worth $4. Screw that, it probably only cost you $1 (or nothing) to tell him about your game, you are better off than you were before. Worrying about getting a fair deal the whole time will cost you a lot of money and sleep.
    • Don’t be afraid to go after the big fish. They are much more friendly and approachable than you might think. And they know the value of relationships otherwise they wouldn’t be where they are. Refer to the point above to figure out how to develop a relationship with them. And act on the advice and info they give you – otherwise they will stop giving you advice and info!

    2. Learn to walk away from games. Here are main reasons why you should walk away from a game:

    • The game is marginal. You going to make a lot more money, have less swings and more sleep if you set yourself a benchmark of only playing the best games. As a rule of thumb, if you think a game might be marginal, it is.
    • Another team/player is getting territorial over the game. In other words, another team would not be happy if you played the game. Unless you have a really strong case for why the game is yours, leave the game. It is not worth it – too many bad things could come of it. Have an abundance mentality and remind yourself there are lots of other great games out there.

    3. Until you have a six fig bankroll save as much money as you can. Until that point every $ you spend is going to cost you many multiples of that. Not being able to leverage the $10k you just spent to upgrade your car on the juicy game you’ve just found means that car cost you a lot more than $10k! Further, having a bigger bankroll makes it easier to take trips to find new games. Which brings me to my next point….

    4. Once you have the bankroll, go after the big games. You have to be willing to travel long distances to potentially find nothing. With this mentality you are going to make a lot more money than travelling back to the place where you found the $500/hour game (and even then the conditions have to be right). The most valuable games I have found/played in the last few years have been in way out places. Trips to AC, Biloxi, LV are likely to yield a steady return but trips to the standalone casino 2 hours away from a big city could result in finding a monster. And that is what will make the most difference to your bottom line at the end of the year.

    5. Listen to Arnie (particularly rule number 4)
    Whether you believe you can or not, you're probably right.

  2. #2
    Senior Member blackjackomaha's Avatar
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    3 out of 3 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Good advice, Percy. I'd like to add a couple more tips that you alluded to:
    • Be careful who you trust. Networking is great; however, don't assume everyone you network with is equally trustworthy or shares your values. We're all in this primarily for the $, although we each go about it a little differently. Don't give up specific information unless you're willing to lose that game forever. Form good long-term friendships and working relationships with whomever you're able.
    • Money Management. We've all heard this and Percy mentioned to save until you have a substantial bankroll. Once you have your bankroll, try to stay as frugal as possible and adhere to a budget.
    • Patience. You must be patient while seeking out games. Look to the future. It's possible to go days or weeks without finding and playing a big game. But if you're persistent, you'll find it.
    • Record Keeping. Always, always, ALWAYS keep good records. This will aid you filing taxes and is a must for tracking your progress. Don't sidestep the IRS.
    • Have Fun.
    You don't score, until you SCORE!

  3. #3
    Senior Member UK-21's Avatar
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    Nice to hear things are working out. Trust you're enjoying life?

    Best wishes.
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  4. #4
    Senior Member Nikky_Flash's Avatar
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    Thank you all kindly, a new-comer here appreciates all advice he can get

  5. #5
    Senior Member UK-21's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Percy View Post
    5. Listen to Arnie (particularly rule number 4)
    Very inspirational. Cheers.
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  6. #6


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    Quote Originally Posted by Percy View Post
    OK, so I’m writing this post because I feel like I have some decent advice to newcomers to this world or casual players looking to take things to the next level. Really this is about what I think it takes to be successful in the AP world. I by no means consider myself the finished article and I still have a lot to learn and achieve, but I am a player who has successfully made the transition from novice to part-time and then from part-time to full-time. You may not agree with the advice I have, fair enough, but hopefully some of you will find it useful:

    1. Network effectively. This is the single biggest determinant of your success as an AP. If it wasn’t the players I’ve met along the way, I would have made a tenth of the money and had a tenth of the fun. Here are my top two tips for networking effectively:

    • Think about what you can do for other people, not what they can do for you. Leverage whatever info and skills you have to help other people. This will help build strong relationships with other players and you will reap the rewards. And don’t worry about everything being ‘fair’ – he told me about a game that is worth $2 when I told him about a game that is worth $4. Screw that, it probably only cost you $1 (or nothing) to tell him about your game, you are better off than you were before. Worrying about getting a fair deal the whole time will cost you a lot of money and sleep.
    • Don’t be afraid to go after the big fish. They are much more friendly and approachable than you might think. And they know the value of relationships otherwise they wouldn’t be where they are. Refer to the point above to figure out how to develop a relationship with them. And act on the advice and info they give you – otherwise they will stop giving you advice and info!

    2. Learn to walk away from games. Here are main reasons why you should walk away from a game:

    • The game is marginal. You going to make a lot more money, have less swings and more sleep if you set yourself a benchmark of only playing the best games. As a rule of thumb, if you think a game might be marginal, it is.
    • Another team/player is getting territorial over the game. In other words, another team would not be happy if you played the game. Unless you have a really strong case for why the game is yours, leave the game. It is not worth it – too many bad things could come of it. Have an abundance mentality and remind yourself there are lots of other great games out there.

    3. Until you have a six fig bankroll save as much money as you can. Until that point every $ you spend is going to cost you many multiples of that. Not being able to leverage the $10k you just spent to upgrade your car on the juicy game you’ve just found means that car cost you a lot more than $10k! Further, having a bigger bankroll makes it easier to take trips to find new games. Which brings me to my next point….

    4. Once you have the bankroll, go after the big games. You have to be willing to travel long distances to potentially find nothing. With this mentality you are going to make a lot more money than travelling back to the place where you found the $500/hour game (and even then the conditions have to be right). The most valuable games I have found/played in the last few years have been in way out places. Trips to AC, Biloxi, LV are likely to yield a steady return but trips to the standalone casino 2 hours away from a big city could result in finding a monster. And that is what will make the most difference to your bottom line at the end of the year.

    5. Listen to Arnie (particularly rule number 4)


    Yeah all of this. Very nice!
    "I think, therfore I can't play blackjack."
    Arnold Snyder, Blackbelt in Blackjack pg. 229 (2005)

  7. #7


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    Excellent advice from a fine player.

  8. #8
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    Paragraph 2, sec. 2,,,,I have a problem with that, but I know others who feel the same way, but,, still have a problem with that.

    Very nice posting and most altruistic Thank you for taking the time to share.

    Best,
    Ouchez

  9. #9
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    1 out of 2 members found this post helpful. Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
    Approaching other APs is a very touchy thing in casinos. I personally think it really depends on the level of a game and the type. Most of the times it will be okay to talk to someone when a game has ended or it's the end of the day. But don't be surprised if they just want to go their separate ways. Don't take it personal, some APs are super paranoid lol

  10. #10


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    Quote Originally Posted by blackjackomaha View Post

    • Have Fun.
    Absolutely
    Whether you believe you can or not, you're probably right.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ouchez View Post
    Paragraph 2, sec. 2,,,,I have a problem with that, but I know others who feel the same way, but,, still have a problem with that.
    I am with Ouchez. No other AP or team is pushing me off my game. The harder they try the firmer I will stand. Now if they approached me nicely we could work out a mutually beneficial and civilized arrangement. If they want war they picked the wrong guy.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    I am with Ouchez. No other AP or team is pushing me off my game. The harder they try the firmer I will stand. Now if they approached me nicely we could work out a mutually beneficial and civilized arrangement. If they want war they picked the wrong guy.

    Well, our Ouchez sometimes has those 'throw down' moments. Needs to release some energy, especially when he feels he has been disrespected. That's cool. That's why we love him. I can appreciate the 'stand your ground' mentality. But it's not my nature. I am more a whimp and a lover, less a fighter.

    I get the feeling that Mr O, is referring to AP opportunities beyond counting, as he often is these days. But with counting, there is almost nothing worse that two counters at the same table raising and lowering their bets in tandem. For me that is a big big negative and works against my top priority of longevity. Not only is two counters raising bets an easy mark for casinos to spot, but now possibly you are 'linked' to this second counter. They think you are working together and/or teammates. It might even be recorded as such, which can effect your play down the road or at other locations. It's all a great big negative. So, I am quick to 'whimp out' or back down and move on.

    Sometimes it can be a little frustrating when I have traveled a half hour to a particular game and they only have 1 or 2 tables, but in general, I am lucky because I have an abundance of games in fairly close proximity. I can see where it would be more challenging for most. But again, I rate everything according to risk vs reward and the risk of not moving on far outweighs the reward and the risk is far too great for me.




    Last edited by KJ; 11-28-2013 at 07:52 AM.

  13. #13
    Senior Member UK-21's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KJ View Post
    . . . Sometimes it can be a little frustrating when I have traveled a half hour to a particular game and they only have 1 or 2 tables. . . .
    Come to the UK - my nearest shoe dealt game is now 100 miles away, and then the conditions aren't great by any measure.

    Better still, try Greece - the nearest shoe dealt blackjack game is in the Country next door . . . .

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