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Thread: beginner: surrender

  1. #1
    beginner
    Guest

    beginner: surrender

    Hi Don

    I have another question about the edge estimation.
    How to estimate play's edge if you may surrender after you hit?

    Robin

  2. #2
    Don Schlesinger
    Guest

    Don Schlesinger: Re: surrender

    > Hi Don

    > I have another question about the edge estimation.
    > How to estimate player's edge if you may surrender after
    > you hit?

    I have no idea. I know only of surrender after doubling, in Spanish 21. Mike Shackleford's site might help.

    wizardofodds.com/spanish21

    Don

  3. #3
    beginner
    Guest

    beginner: Re: surrender

    > I have no idea. I know only of surrender after
    > doubling, in Spanish 21. Mike Shackleford's site might
    > help.

    > wizardofodds.com/spanish21

    > Don

    Yes, I found some spanish 21 games with the variable rules.
    one of the rule is you may surrender after you hit.
    I could not found the EV with this rule in Mike Shackleford's site or Katarina walker's book.
    I want to calculate my EV then jump in the game.
    would you tell me if some casino provide this rule in Blackjack games, how to calculate the EV?


  4. #4
    Don Schlesinger
    Guest

    Don Schlesinger: Re: surrender

    > Yes, I found some spanish 21 games with the variable
    > rules.
    > one of the rule is you may surrender after you hit.
    > I could not found the EV with this rule in Mike
    > Shackleford's site or Katarina walker's book.
    > I want to calculate my EV then jump in the game.
    > would you tell me if some casino provide this rule in
    > Blackjack games, how to calculate the EV?

    For regular BJ, the edge is given by Wong, in "Basic Blackjack," p. 73, to be about 0.2%. Of course, that is BS, and it may be worth much more to the card counter.

    Don

  5. #5
    beginner
    Guest

    beginner: Re: surrender

    > For regular BJ, the edge is given by Wong, in
    > "Basic Blackjack," p. 73, to be about 0.2%.
    > Of course, that is BS, and it may be worth much more
    > to the card counter.

    > Don

    Thanks Don.
    It is really helpful to me.

    Best regards,
    Robin

  6. #6
    beginner
    Guest

    beginner: Re: surrender

    Hi Don

    In the stanford wong's book, the EV is for late surrender.
    how to estimation the EV on surrender on any number of card with early surrender?

    Best Regards,
    Robin

  7. #7
    Don Schlesinger
    Guest

    Don Schlesinger: Re: surrender

    > Hi Don

    > In the stanford wong's book, the EV is for late
    > surrender.
    > how to estimation the EV on surrender on any number of
    > card with early surrender?

    BS ES is worth 0.6 to 0.7% depending on rules. To a bet-spreading card-counter, it is, clearly, worth much more.

    I have never heard of ES being allowed on any number of cards. I would guess that the BS edge would be considerably higher still.

    If you have a very specific set of rules in mind, please furnish them, and I will try to get you an answer.

    Don

  8. #8
    Dog Hand
    Guest

    Dog Hand: One Obvious Change

    If you're allowed Early Surrender on any number of cards (would that be abbreviated ES3?), then of course you would NOT ES with 5, 6, or 7 vs. A.

    Dog Hand

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