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Thread: Cacarulo: The HALVES vs ZEN dispute

  1. #27
    Don Schlesinger
    Guest

    Don Schlesinger: Really?! :-)

    I'd have never guessed! :-)

    Don

  2. #28
    JohnAuston
    Guest

    JohnAuston: Isn't anyone going to comment?

    We have sims purporting to show that Zen's Insurance advantage over Halves (Doubled) is so large, that it turns an across-the-board disadvantage into an across-the-board advantage.

    Can this be?

    Is this how one should look at the issue:?

    Key card tags in play for Insurance index:

    Ace: Zen -1 Halves -2
    10 Zen -2 Halves -2
    9 Zen 0 Halves -1

    Most important thing for Insurace is knowledge of 10's

    For this, Halves is worse two ways: counts ace same as 10, and counts 9 in with 10's, so the 10's richness can be "polluted" with excess aces and 9's.

    Zen will never be "polluted" by 9's , and excess aces will only pollute at half the rate of Halves.

    So Havles will have you taking Insurance when you shouldn't, and with bigger bets out there.

  3. #29
    Zenfighter
    Guest

    Zenfighter: Re: Insurance insights (no sims) on Theory Page *NM*


  4. #30
    Zenfighter
    Guest

    Zenfighter: Re: Halves /Zen 1000 M Rounds for each one

    6dks, s17, das, spl3, spa1, 5/6, Catch 22 as per SBA

    TCs = floored down

    TC resolution = ? deck

    Halves -1 .5 1 1 1.5 1 .5 0 -.5 ?1 (adjusted per full deck)

    Zen -1 1 1 2 2 2 1 0 0 -2 (adjusted per full deck)

    1000 Million rounds for each one.

    Software used: CVCX


     
    Bet spread K.B Av.B %W/L $/100 SD/100 RoR N0 DI SCORE

    HALVES

    PA Opt.(1-12) 740 33.69 1.13 38.00 638.55 13.5 26328 6.16 37.97
    PA Opt.(1-16) 837 33.96 1.30 44.00 666.02 13.5 22722 6.63 44.00

    ZEN

    PA Opt.(1-12) 743 32.79 1.12 36.79 585.26 13.5 27215 6.06 36.74
    PA Opt.(1-16) 838 33.06 1.29 42.71 656.86 13.5 23417 6.53 42.70




    Sincerely

    Zenfighter

  5. #31
    Zenfighter
    Guest

    Zenfighter: Re: Accuracy of Halves' SCORES confirmed

    Halves figures double-checked, already:

    Cacarulo?s software: (half deck estimation with tags doubled)

     
    1-12 $38.04 $37.97 (CVCX) dif = $0.07 (due to the length of both sims)

    1-16 $43.96 $44.00 (CVCX) dif = $0.04 (same as above)



    Noticeable discrepancies with Zen?s SCORES. Possibilities:

    1) I?ve done something strange with the Zen?s settings.

    2) He has done something strange with the Zen?s settings.

    3) There is something strange with CVCX and the Zen count.

    4) There is something strange with Cac?s one and/or SBA and the Zen count.

    Food for thought.

    Zenfighter

  6. #32
    Norm Wattenberger
    Guest

    Norm Wattenberger: Some more sims

    I ran the same sims that Cac ran with CVData. Surely enough the same conclusions were reached. I also generated new indexes with CVData and ran the sims again. The Halves sims improved slightly and beat Zen in some cases. However, the difference was tiny. As Cac ran twice as many rounds I would go with his sims. In any case, Halves and Zen with these rules and penetration appear to perform very closely indeed.

  7. #33
    Cacarulo
    Guest

    Cacarulo: Re: Some more sims

    > I ran the same sims that Cac ran with
    > CVData. Surely enough the same conclusions
    > were reached. I also generated new indexes
    > with CVData and ran the sims again. The
    > Halves sims improved slightly and beat Zen
    > in some cases. However, the difference was
    > tiny. As Cac ran twice as many rounds I
    > would go with his sims. In any case, Halves
    > and Zen with these rules and penetration
    > appear to perform very closely indeed.

    Thanks Norm for verifying the sims.

    Sincerely,
    Cac

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