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Thread: Question About Ace Side Count for AOII

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    Question About Ace Side Count for AOII

    I'm going through Bryce Carlson's book Blackjack For Blood. In it he describes that the ace side count should be used for "betting purposes only." Does this mean that one doesn't incorporate the ace count into the true count? I'll illustrate my question with an example.

    Suppose we're playing a two deck game and there's 1.5 decks left in the shoe. The running count is +9 and no aces have shown. Then the ace running count is +13. Should my true count be +9/(3/2) = +6 or should my true count be +13/(3/2) = +9?

    Thanks for your help!

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    Quote Originally Posted by LingBling View Post
    Should my true count be +9/(3/2) = +6 or should my true count be +13/(3/2) = +9?
    The latter. But RC +13 with one and a half decks left is TC +8. TC + 9 starts at RC +13.5

    It's not much of a big deal for betting but the ace is important to include in some playing decisions where the distinction is more important. The ace info is important for insurance decisions, Doubling 10vT, Doubling 11v(7-10) and some of the weaker soft doubles. It can be used for making many other decisions more accurate but these are the lions share of both influence and money to be made.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    The latter. But RC +13 with one and a half decks left is TC +8. TC + 9 starts at RC +13.5
    So I was rounding 13/(3/2) = 26/3 to 9 because it was the closest integer. Is it better to always round down until the integer is reached, like a step function?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    It's not much of a big deal for betting but the ace is important to include in some playing decisions where the distinction is more important. The ace info is important for insurance decisions, Doubling 10vT, Doubling 11v(7-10) and some of the weaker soft doubles. It can be used for making many other decisions more accurate but these are the lions share of both influence and money to be made.
    Is there a good resource for the importance and influence of the ace side count like in these examples? From what I've seen, Bryce Carlson's book doesn't go into too much detail about the ace side count. Thanks for your reply.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LingBling View Post
    So I was rounding 13/(3/2) = 26/3 to 9 because it was the closest integer. Is it better to always round down until the integer is reached, like a step function?
    No matter what system (rounding, truncating or flooring) you use it should be the same as used in your simulations, you should be consistent and each system has a step function as a result. Rounding and flooring each have equal 1 TC steps just at different ranges. Flooring TC 0 is TC 0 to TC +0.99999. Rounding has TC 0 from -0.499999 to +0.4999999. The weird one is truncating. It has TC 0 as TC -0.99999 to +0.99999. A step with a 2 TC range with all other steps as a 1 TC range. TC +1 as TC +1 to TC +1.999999. I think Wong advocates truncating. Most often used is flooring because the math ends at the decimal so it is faster. Some use rounding but sometimes the TC conversion must go to one decimal place to get your integer TC answer rather than giving an integer answer when the decimal is reached like truncating and flooring.

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    Senior Member Nikky_Flash's Avatar
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    I'm just surprised they use shoes for Double-Deck games...
    “It seemed to me ... that any civilization that had so far lost its head as to need to include a set of detailed instructions for use in a package of toothpicks, was no longer a civilization in which I could live and stay sane.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikky_Flash View Post
    I'm just surprised they use shoes for Double-Deck games...
    You may be trying to be funny but I played a double deck shoe game dealt face up. It was almost 10 years ago but it was in Reno. It was my first time there and I haven't been back since. So I don't know if this is odd there or if it is long gone or still being dealt.

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    Senior Member bigplayer's Avatar
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    Say your base running count is +8 with 4 decks left so your TC for playing decision purposes is +2. Then suppose you've seen no aces yet (you have an excess of 8 aces left in the shoe) You would add +2 to your running count for each excess Ace so you'd have Raw RC +8 AND 16 for the excess Aces for a Betting RC of +24/4 = Betting TC +6 There are also multi-parameter indexes for the Ace that can increase your playing efficiency.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tthree View Post
    You may be trying to be funny but I played a double deck shoe game dealt face up. It was almost 10 years ago but it was in Reno. It was my first time there and I haven't been back since. So I don't know if this is odd there or if it is long gone or still being dealt.
    Thought it would save the casino time to just have the person hold it...when are you getting an avatar? ... lol
    “It seemed to me ... that any civilization that had so far lost its head as to need to include a set of detailed instructions for use in a package of toothpicks, was no longer a civilization in which I could live and stay sane.

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    An outdated reply...... are you a professional blackjack player or a mathematician?

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